Episode nine: Youth Engagement Project

Skye and Madeleine

Podcast Recap:
In this episode, Madeleine chats with Skye, co-founder of the Youth Engagement Project, about practical ways parents can connect with and support young people. Skye shares the three guiding principles of the project — be yourself, be awake, be curious — and explains how they help build authentic connections.

They explore the psychological needs of autonomy, competence, and relatedness, and discuss the PACE framework (Playfulness, Acceptance, Curiosity, Empathy) as a powerful tool for strengthening relationships.

Skye leaves parents with encouragement to keep showing up, stay curious, and know that the small moments of connection really matter.

Full Podcast Transcript:

Madeleine:  Hi, Skye. Welcome. I'm so grateful for the opportunity to chat with you about the Youth Engagement Project and to discuss some key principles you deliver to teachers and others who work with young people, because I think sharing it with parents is just going to be absolutely gold. I was lucky enough to attend the Youth Engagement Project workshop led by Amanda, your colleague, or, co-founder, to the Ryde Hunters Hill Youth Interagency and was just blown away by the fun and interactive delivery. And then just by the simplicity in the way that everyone can implement strategies to connect better with young people. So welcome. Thank you so much for joining us. Can you please start by telling us a bit about yourself and the origins of the Youth Engagement Project?

Skye: Of course. And firstly, thank you, Maddie, and hello to your community. Very, very excited to be having this conversation. And no pressure to, you know, be up against Amanda after her, your amazing experience at Ryde. 

I think you really hit the nail on the head with what we love doing, and that's really taking these big concepts or theoretical concepts and trying to really simplify them so they are digestible and applicable to as many people as possible. 

So as you said, I'm the other co-founder of Youth Engagement Project. And the Youth Engagement Project really started on this need that we saw in the youth landscape and what that was going. There are more resources available to young people than there ever has been before. There is more funding in this space than there ever has been before. And yet the mental health and wellbeing of our young people continues to decline. And we saw a real issue with that. 

Amanda and I have both been educators for over ten years, working in a whole range of educative spaces. So for myself, that's working in the public private system and also up in the NT, for Amanda, where she spent a long time working in a remote indigenous community up in West Arnhem Land. We have really seen that the needs of our young people, regardless of where it is that they are situated both in Australia and also internationally, they're facing a lot of the same struggles. So we really got our heads together. 

We're not only co-founders, but we've also been best friends for ten years. So it's very, very special to be doing this together. 

We really started to think about, well, what is the best way that we can support, with the experience that we have, with the study that we've got beneath our belt and, you know, the practical application years that we've had to really try some of these strategies out in person. 

And so we decided the gap was, how do we support the people who are supporting young people? These are our youth stakeholders. These are our teachers, our youth workers, our counsellors, our parents, the ones that are on the ground every single day giving it their all to support our young people. Quite often it's just an expectation that they know what to do and know what to say and know how to engage and show up. And yet, it's not something that is actively practiced or taught in a lot of spaces. 

So for us, we were like, we can slide on in there. And that's kind of how the Youth Engagement Project was born. And now we get to work with organisations all across Australia. We're starting to work more internationally as well to really bring some of these concepts to life. And so people can be applying them with the young people they're supporting.

Madeleine: It's absolutely wonderful. And thank you for sliding into that space, because the tools that I was introduced to were just absolutely amazing. And I thought, wow, this is really simple. So do you think you could share some of the key principles and strategies that the Youth Engagement Project has developed with our parent community?

Skye: Yes, of course. So I guess I'd love to kind of start with the principles that we open up any training with. We also think about this as being applicable in any space that we're working with young people. So our three rules that we set up, our agreements that we set up are. 

• Be yourself. 

• Be awake and 

• be curious.

And when we talk about the way that we show up for young people, we know that authenticity, that piece about being yourself, is one of the best gifts that we can give the young people in our lives. Young people, as we know, have the best BS radars out there, and when we show up as not ourselves, when we aren't being authentic, they can read that. And really, we have such a brief when we're working with young people, both as a parent or as an educator. Sometimes it can feel like a really brief window of connection where they're making a judgement about who we are. And so the best way we can support that connection is just by staying true to ourselves and being authentic. 

When we talk about being awake, we're not talking about don't fall asleep when you're hanging out with young people or, you know, fall asleep in a workshop. But really, we're talking about how do we be more present with the young people in our lives. We have so many distractions. As you know, we have phones pinging, we have emails coming in. We have, you know, our grocery list waiting for us. We have the kid pick up and drop off waiting. And when we can actually just find those moments of presence and really be present with the young people in our worlds, it is just incredible the difference that that makes to how they feel in terms of being seen and heard and loved for exactly who they are. 

And when we talk about being curious, we fundamentally believe that we cannot sit in both curiosity and in judgement at the same time. So we find ourselves sitting in judgement of ourselves and our parenting. Perhaps, if we find ourselves judging our young people in the way that they're showing up, because we can always look at that from a developmental perspective, too. If we find ourselves judging other parents in our community or other caregivers that we interact with, there's every chance that we are not showing up in curiosity and we are limiting ourselves right there, and the growth that we can have and the connection that we can have. It's the same thing. We're so quick when we work with young people because we want to protect them, right? We want to give them the best possible path forward in their lives. And it's really, really easy to jump into wanting to do things for them and make the path really smooth. Make sure that there's minimal struggle. And what we do there is we make a quick judgement, a quick assessment, and we come in and we fix that problem. And what we're doing is we're not getting curious as to the internal resources that this young person has within them, the capabilities they have within themselves that we can empower and instil by sitting in that curious space. And so often that's just asking questions. What do you think that we could do in this situation? Well, let's have a look around. What tools have we got for support right now as opposed to offering that solution first? So that's one of our biggest principles.

Madeleine: I do love it. I will just throw in there the wonderful golden nugget I heard was to be curious, not furious. And I think that's that. It's just so easy also for us, particularly as we're busy, to jump in and, as you say, want to fix, because they were totally dependent on us when they were tiny. So as parents, it's actually getting that rubber band a little bit more stretched and stretched so that we can let that happen.

Skye: And even I'm noticing it now. I'm the new mum of a four and a half month old, beautiful baby Max. And even he's at the moment, he's going through a developmental leap. He's learning how to roll. And it's so easy as a parent even to watch your baby rolling around on the floor, and you just want to put your hands in and just and just help them, just get them over that little bit extra. But even giving them the opportunity to struggle at such a young age is integral for their brain development and their growth and building that mental resilience. And so even just being able to sit back and listen to him are, you know, as he's trying to get over, it takes everything in your power to hold yourself back from wanting to jump in. But it is so important for that development. And that's a baby and it is and is relevant at every single stage of a young person's development. So that's one of our kind of core principles. And I think what it's really doing. 

And something else I'd love to touch on is that what we're doing is we're training our young people and we're supporting their development to really treat stress in their life and viewing stress as being a challenge rather than being a threat. And so often the way that we perceive stressors in our lives, and particularly as we're going through those developmental leaves of, of puberty and entering early adulthood, is is stress feels like it's everywhere, whether it's stress from school, whether it's stress from friendship, breakdowns, whatever it may be. And when our bodies perceive that as a threat, we know as adults what happens. We go into that fight or flight. We have a really somatic bodily response to that stress. When we feel it as a threat in our systems, so as parents, as educators, as those supporting young people, we can help to reframe stress as being seen as a challenge. And when we reframe it as a challenge by staying curious, by asking questions, by highlighting and pointing out both the internal and external resources that a young person has on offer, we are supporting their system to develop that mental resilience, to develop the capacity to be able to regulate themselves, to problem solve. And what we will have then is hopefully a generation of young people who are prepared for what is to come as opposed to constantly looking for my where's my handout? Who's going to help me get out of this? And they find that within themselves.

Madeleine: Wow. Just just wow. Thank you. I know that you're going to share, is it the PACE model? Is that all right? Have you got time to do that?

Skye: Yes of course.  Before we even go there, let's talk to the psychological needs of young people, because it kind of all relates to the psychological needs of young people. 

Amanda and I have been privileged enough to have time now that we've stepped out of the education system to do a whole bunch of research. And we have really done a deep dive into a theory called self-determination theory. And self-determination theory really posits that there are three core psychological needs of young people that need to be met in order for them to feel self-determined in their lives. And this isn't just applicable to young people, it's also applicable for adults. It's a human theory. And those core psychological needs are that of:

•  autonomy, 

• competence, and 

• relatedness 

And so autonomy is the feeling that one has volition, the one the feeling that one has choice in their life. 

When we talk about competence, we're talking about what we call this feeling of optimal challenge. I like to think of it as Goldilocks. You know, it's the porridge that's not too hot, not too cold. It's just right. And we need to think about competence in the same way. So how are we providing an environment of optimal challenge for our young people where they can feel successful without it feeling too easy or too hard? 

And finally, the third psychological need is that of relatedness in this piece. And parents will absolutely relate to this. But it's really that feeling about belonging. It's knowing that our young people have a space where they can feel heard, feel seen to show up as exactly who they are and be respected for who they are and be loved for who they are. And that's that relatedness piece. 

And so, we go into obviously a whole lot more detail into how we meet these psychological needs, but one of the frameworks that we teach in order to build that relatedness piece, in particular, that real sense of connection and belonging with our young people, is an acronym. PACE.  and PACE was something developed by a psychologist, Doctor Dan Hughes, and the 

• P stands for playfulness 

• A stands for acceptance 

• C stands for curiosity and the 

• E stands for empathy. 

And when we think about challenging behaviours that can sometimes appear as our young people are pushing boundaries as they are working out who they are, as they are testing the waters both at home and at school and in their world. What we know is that it's so quick to step into that judgement place and go, well, this is the rule and this is how we do it in this house, and yada yada yada yada yada. 

And so often it can actually really push and isolate that young person from us. So we always say connection before correction. And so if we think about how do we connect with our young people. PACEis a framework that we can do that. 

So being playful, how do we introduce and and and find that playfulness in our day to day. And sometimes that's just language. It might be like alright, it's bath time team. How quick do we think we can strip off, put the bath on and jump on in? And we just as opposed to dinner's going to be ready in ten minutes, we come on guys, bath time, let's go. And just the difference in our, in our tonality and the way that we can interact with our young people in our homes and in our schools, that's really where that playfulness can come in. 

And the acceptance piece is really about just us going, you are exactly enough as you are. However you choose to show up today and in this moment, you are exactly enough as you are. And we accept them. We accept whatever the emotion is, we accept however it is that they're showing up in that space, knowing that so often the most challenging behaviours show up for us as parents and caregivers because we are our young persons safe place. And I think we forget that sometimes too, is that we get to see the biggest end of spectrum of emotions and things like that, because we are that young person's safety net and they have, um, they feel safe to do that with us. And so when we see them and we accept them and we say, there's nothing that you could do that would make me love you any less, and we just accept them in that moment. And that's, you know, a beautifully supportive strategy and tool. 

The key is that curiosity piece. And that's really about staying curious exactly as we spoke about earlier. It's saying if I'm getting a big emotion or my young person's maybe showing up and it feels different, or I'm feeling a bit more disconnected than I normally do from my young person, rather than being critical rather than judging. Let's get curious about it. Well, maybe what's changed for them? What's going on right now? Let's have a look at what's happening socially at school. Let's have a look at other things outside of that immediate, um, relationship that we have with them. I think it's really easy, right? Our young people are always a mirror. They're a reflection of who we are and what's going on inside of us sometimes. So we need to get curious and step outside of that, too. 

And finally is empathy. And we know there's a big difference between empathy and sympathy and empathy, saying like, hey, I'm in this with you. I'm here. I'm by your side, I see you. And that's a really big difference to, oh, that sounds really tough, darling. And, you know, there's a big difference between the way that we can show up in that empathetic space. 

And one of the best things, I guess, being a teacher and being in the classroom for over ten years really taught me that. Our young people don't always want advice. They don't always want someone to tell them how to do it. Sometimes they just want someone to listen. And the best thing we can do is say, what do you need right now? Do you need someone to listen? Or would you like advice? And just by asking that question that gives the autonomy back to the young person, it gives them that choice and volition to ask for what they need. And it also gives them that relatedness piece. It's saying, hey, this adult, this person is here for me, regardless of what it is that I need in this moment. And sometimes they won't know. And that's okay. Just being there and showing up is perfectly enough. So that's a little bit about pace and a little bit about the psychological needs.

Madeleine: I do, you know.  Hilariously I'm sitting here taking so many notes because it just all, it all resonates and sings so true. And, I think it's all because it's deeply from the heart as well. So I think that that's why it is. Everything that you say is so special. So, thank you very much. Because we do have such a short period of time. So I just appreciate how much you've packed into that. I know how helpful that will be to parents. I'm sure that they'll be sitting scribing away as well. Um, is there anything else that you wanted to share around?

Skye: I guess if I could offer some encouragement to parents, and particularly if they are feeling maybe disconnected from their young person in their life that they're supporting. I think that if you're worried about whether you're doing a good job, you're already a fantastic parent. That's, the first thing to remember. You're already doing an amazing job. We all go through times, I think of feeling disconnected from the young people in our lives. So it's also completely normal if we are feeling that way with our young person. And I think it's important to remember that often, particularly as we're moving into those teenage years and adolescence, often teenagers, they don't push away because they don't care, but they push away because they're learning how to be themselves. They're really testing those boundaries, testing where those lines are testing to make sure mom and dad or caregiver shows up for me, and just being a steady presence, even when it may not be acknowledged by the young person in your life that matters so much more than you think, just by consistently showing up and being there. And I guess connection doesn't have to be those big dramatic moments, right? Sometimes connection. It's just simply sitting together in silence. Maybe it's showing up at a soccer game. Maybe it's asking about their world with genuine curiosity and just asking better questions. It's those small moments of connection that stack and build a really, really healthy and solid foundation to a relationship.

Madeleine: Oh thank you. That's beautiful. Thank you so much. Did you have anything else that you wanted to share?

Skye: No, just. You don't have to get it perfect. Perfect doesn't exist. Just keep leaning in, keep showing up. And your young person, whether they express it now or they express it later, please know that they are hearing you. I am, I literally like I said, I've just become a mum. And the day after I gave birth and uh, came home, brought my baby home from hospital, I rang my mum and I said, mum, I get it now. Thank you so much for everything that you have done for us. I really get it now. Um, and it's been such a beautiful, transformative moment in our personal relationship and, you know, but it's taken 30 plus years to get there and for me to have that appreciation and so please know it will come eventually. It's the best thing we can do right now is just keep showing up.

Madeleine: Oh, I love that. And the word that we mentioned before I recorded was that authenticity. And thank you for your authenticity and for sharing so much. So if people want to learn more about the youth engagement project, where do they go?

Skye: You can find us on Instagram at Youth Engagement Project. Uh, all one word. We post little tips and tricks. We work a lot in the public speaking space as well. So there's lots of things on there. Uh, and then our website is just ww.com, and you can have a look at a whole bunch of stuff there. We have a podcast. We've got a few different things that we offer in terms of support tools, so please feel free to reach out. We're always open to a DM or a conversation.

Madeleine: Ah thank you. Thank you so much and congratulations on creating such a brilliant platform. Thank you Skye.

Skye: Thanks, Maddie. I'm looking forward to our next chat.

Madeleine: Yes, same. Thank you Skye. Thank you so much for sharing your time and insights. Just to repeat, if you'd like to learn more about the Youth Engagement Project, you can find them on Instagram at Youth Engagement Project and visit their website on www.youthengagementproject.com

And if you'd like to know more about EPIC or join the EPIC community, head to our website at www.empoweringparentsincrisis.com, where you'll find resources, events, and ways to connect with other parents just like you. Thanks for listening and we hope to connect with you in the EPIC community one day soon.  

Gratitude to the Youth Engagement Project for their support of EPIC and of parents in our community.

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This podcast was made possible by the support of the City of Ryde Council